Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted

My 3 yo Aussie mix has always been very fearful & shy & was not properly socialized as a puppy. We also have 2 small senior Chihuahuas & 3 cats & they were here before Bailey. Bailey is fine with all in their daily comings & goings. The issue that happens is primarily when I'm sitting on the couch & one of the cats or dogs is laying beside me. Bailey comes to sit at my feet for a pet. All can be fine & then I tell her to go to her bed, which she will. However, occasionally, & TOTALLY without warning (no hard stare, growl, etc) Bailey will lung & snap @ the othother animal. Then immediately stop & run into her crate or bed. She obviously knows this is bad behavior. She used to attack when all dogs would come into bathroom in a.m. while I was getting ready. So I simply shut the door & no one comes in. But how do I stop the aggression at the couch if she already knows she's wrong & puts herself in "time out" ? 

Posted

Hello and welcome to the forums,

I am glad that you were able to easily solve the bathroom issue by shutting the door. 

I have a few questions to better understand the situation. 

-How long have you had Bailey?

-How old are the Chihuahuas?

-Has she always acted this way towards your other dogs and cats or is this a fairly new behavior?

-Have you noticed an exact trigger when you are petting her? Like what are the dogs/cats doing right before Bailey lunges and snaps? Are they coming closer to you? Are they making eye contact with her? Are they on the couch or are they on the floor?

-What do your other cats or dogs do when she reacts this way?

-Has she ever hurt any of your other pets? Has she acted aggressive towards them in other circumstances (other than the bathroom episodes)?

Thanks for the extra details. 

 

 

Posted

I've had Bailey since she was 8-9 weeks old. She & her brother had been abandoned along side a highway at approximately 8 weeks & I adopted her through a rescue group. I was told she was the timid pup of several pups the group had. We had 4 cats at the time & other than wanting to chase them (which I successfully corrected) she didn't show any aggression. The Chihuahuas are now 11 years each. Approximately age 1 1/2 Bailey started picking unprovoked fights with Brandy, the female Chihuahua and would decide to attack her at various times for no decernable reason. I didn't have to be present. She never injured her, it was more of a mauling her around. At age 1 1/2 I enrolled her in a group training class & she was fine. iI had already been working on basics with her but wanted her ecposed to new people & animals. She did fine but did not want to be petted by anyone. No growls, just pushing against my leg. But the Brandy attacks & bathroom attacks continued. At age 2 we started with a one on one dog trainer. Bailey learned a lot & I worked with her a lot. She is pretty well trained but I'm going to start working with her daily again. Her tells prior to attack have been the hard stare. Sometimes I could distract her but often the minute I spoke she'd attack. Have mostly gotten that under control using her sit/stay commands & avoiding likely situations. And on an average day  they interact fine. The last few incidents have involved me sitting at the end of the couch. Either one of the small dogs, or cat, will be laying on the couch beside me on the right. I won't let Bailey come for a pet on the right to avoid issues.So she comes on my left side for her pet. On 3-4 occasions now she has lunged to attack the other animal across my knees. Either dog or cat. No growl & no stare. From totally calm to Cujo. The instant she does this I automatically shout & she immediately stops & runs either to her bed or to her crate. She can also be in her bed & another animal can walk past & she's fine. But she will occasionally lunge/snap at them. Just never know when it will happen. Last week one of the cats was sitting in the window above her bed & I saw her hard staring at the cat. I was on the couch 10' away & I immediately stood & called to her ,not yelling but just saying her name, and she lunged/snapped at the cat then ran into her crate. The cats & dogs have mostly learned to keep an eye on her. And I NEVER leave all of them alone together. If I'm not in the room either Bailey goes in her crate or I put the small ones in their room. I don't believe the other animals have stared at her. On the couch they're just laying beside me & relaxed. And the cat inthe window had her back to Bailey. I normally walk Bailey & the litudogs each morning for approximately an hour and Bailey never shows aggression, even if sniffing the same clump of weeds. However my husband has had serious medical issues lately & I've been unable to walk each day. I do know Bailey needs exercise so am taking time this evening. I apologize that this is so long & rambling. I just have been unable to place Bailey in any one category. It's normally been when I've been close, but not always. So very frustrating. Any advice appreciated!

Posted

Thank you for the additional details, they are very helpful! Also, wanted to thank you for rescuing, it is wonderful that you have opened your heart and home to Bailey being that she was abandoned along a highway. How sad! But I am glad this story has a happy ending.

Please see my notes under your observations in bold. Please also understand that being unable to watch their interactions and their accompanying body language prevents me from being able to make an accurate assessment about the triggers and dynamics taking place, so I am just going by the descriptions provided, imagining the scenes and possible triggers as I read. 

"Approximately age 1 1/2 Bailey started picking unprovoked fights with Brandy, the female Chihuahua and would decide to attack her at various times for no decernable reason. I didn't have to be present. She never injured her, it was more of a mauling her around."

What you are experiencing is unfortunately a common scenario. Us dog trainers/behavior consultants see this happen quite often, the typical cliché' of a younger dog being  introduced into a household with older dogs and things starting deteriorating as time goes by. Studies and research on fights among dogs sharing the household household back this all up. 

Typically, the classical situation is this: a new puppy is added into a household with older resident dogs. The puppy and older resident dogs initially get along fine for several months. Then, somewhere around 12 and 36 months, the first signs of conflict/competition are noticed. Studies show that the conflict/competition starts becoming most apparent when these pups reach social maturity, which takes place around 18 to 24 months.

Sources of competition often include resources such as food, sleeping areas, toys, tight passageways, and even access to favorite people. Conflict is also often seen when owners give attention to their dogs or when the dogs greet their owners after being away or out of the home for some time. Fights may also sometimes erupt over sleeping areas nearby the owner.

Statistically, fights are more likely to occur between dogs of the same sex, in particular between two female dogs. A younger, larger and more agile dog is often the one competing against an older dog. 

'At age 1 1/2 I enrolled her in a group training class & she was fine. iI had already been working on basics with her but wanted her ecposed to new people & animals. She did fine but did not want to be petted by anyone. No growls, just pushing against my leg. But the Brandy attacks & bathroom attacks continued.  At age 2 we started with a one on one dog trainer. Bailey learned a lot & I worked with her a lot. She is pretty well trained but I'm going to start working with her daily again."

It is great that you have enrolled her in group and then private classes. Even if the classes won't tackle the fight-issues directly, they can help you attain a better level of voice control while also teaching better impulse control and frustration tolerance. However, the ideal approach here would be having a professional come into your home and tackle directly the fighting issue. More than actual training, this would involve implementation of management strategies and likely behavior modification.

"Her tells prior to attack have been the hard stare. Sometimes I could distract her but often the minute I spoke she'd attack. Have mostly gotten that under control using her sit/stay commands & avoiding likely situations. And on an average day they interact fine. The last few incidents have involved me sitting at the end of the couch. Either one of the small dogs, or cat, will be laying on the couch beside me on the right. I won't let Bailey come for a pet on the right to avoid issues. So she comes on my left side for her pet. On 3-4 occasions now she has lunged to attack the other animal across my knees. Either dog or cat. No growl & no stare."

That's good that you have identified a precursor to the attacks.  Attacks with no warning are much more difficult to tackle and have a more complicated prognosis since they are so unpredictable. However, yes, it can be difficult to interrupt things once they started and fights can often start real fast, especially when eye contact or movement is a trigger.

 Often, when dogs are believed to attack other dogs out of the blue, there's just this second of eye contact that we can easily miss, and of course, we can't keep our eyes glued on their body language all day long. 

It doesn't sound like your dogs or cats are doing anything particularly "daring" like physically getting in between when you are petting Bailey. From your description it sounds like they are just laying on the couch. 

Being that your other dogs/cats are on the couch, it could be that she feels triggered by something rather subtle such as eye contact from the above so when she's being pet and their eyes meet, she goes into attack mode. Or she could be just misinterpreting any of their movements perceiving them as an intent of coming closer to you so she prematurely reacts to that. 

On a more positive note, the fact that the fights occur mostly when you are sitting on the couch and not in other cases (other than the bathroom, which you have solved by closing the door) gives you some control over the situation, versus dogs who attack other dogs sharing the home for a multitude of reasons (food, toys, space, exiting doors first etc).

However, this is something that needs worked on, because in some cases, these attacks may generalize to other triggers and situations. Also, the dogs/cats victim of the "potentially unprovoked"  attacks, can start getting tense and react to Bailey (which further complicates things) or they may start living in fear, afraid of just moving around freely (and even breathing for some!)

When an attack occurs, we therefore need to consider that damage to the relationship between the dogs/cats can be difficult to repair. So we want to avoid getting to that  dramatic point. 

"So she comes on my left side for her pet. On 3-4 occasions now she has lunged to attack the other animal across my knees. Either dog or cat. No growl & no stare. From totally calm to Cujo. "

We need to tread with caution here since you are so near and "sandwiched" between Bailey and your other dogs/cats. When there is tension like this, even just instinctively moving your knee to block an attack or stretching an arm to grab a collar, can lead to a re-directed bite. 

 "The instant she does this I automatically shout & she immediately stops & runs either to her bed or to her crate. "

This demonstrates voice control and it's good she stops in her tracks and runs to her bed or crate versus continuing to attack. Likely, your tone denotes that she is in trouble, so she gives herself an "auto-timeout" knowing that in the crate she feels safe. 

However, this is just a semi-management option and doesn't tackle the issue directly.  If the attacks keep happening, we know that she likely she has an intent to not back down and will do it again until the next opportunity. We also need o consider safety if you don't catch her quickly enough. 

"She can also be in her bed & another animal can walk past & she's fine. But she will occasionally lunge/snap at them. Just never know when it will happen. "

It sounds like she may be protective of her sleeping/resting areas. It may be best to keep her crated during nap time, or using a tall exercise pen with her bed or crate inside (crate can be left open inside of the pen if the pen is tall enough to prevent escape). Her bed/crate should be in a quiet area so that she doesn't feel the need to guard. 

"Last week one of the cats was sitting in the window above her bed & I saw her hard staring at the cat. I was on the couch 10' away & I immediately stood & called to her ,not yelling but just saying her name, and she lunged/snapped at the cat then ran into her crate. The cats & dogs have mostly learned to keep an eye on her. And I NEVER leave all of them alone together. If I'm not in the room either Bailey goes in her crate or I put the small ones in their room." 

This seems to confirm her not liking other dogs/cats being above her and likely a tendency of guarding her bed. It sounds like she benefits from having her own sleeping area where she can rest undisturbed and stop rehearsing the lunging and snapping behaviors. 

"I don't believe the other animals have stared at her. On the couch they're just laying beside me & relaxed. And the cat in the window had her back to Bailey."

I fear here that Bailey is reacting to very subtle things such as the other pets moving their eyes or head looking around or just moving like to lick, move the tail or change position. I have known some dogs become reactive towards other pets' muscles twitching during deep REM sleep!

 Australian shepherds can be very movement controlling dogs, they were selectively bred to control the movements of stubborn sheep. This requires an A-type personality and they can try to micro-manage anything that moves. 

"I normally walk Bailey & the litudogs each morning for approximately an hour and Bailey never shows aggression, even if sniffing the same clump of weeds. However my husband has had serious medical issues lately & I've been unable to walk each day. I do know Bailey needs exercise so am taking time this evening. "

So sorry to hear about your husband not feeling well. Less exercise can certainly drive these dogs' energy up the roofs.  Brain games, training, walks and exercise is needed with these dogs. It would also be helpful to provide activities that provide outlets for her herding needs (sport of Treibball, herding trials). 

"She obviously knows this is bad behavior. She used to attack when all dogs would come into bathroom in a.m. while I was getting ready. So I simply shut the door & no one comes in. But how do I stop the aggression at the couch if she already knows she's wrong & puts herself in "time out" ? "

In this case, more than stopping the aggression at the couch, I think the safest option and the best one for your other pets who apparently are impacted from her behavior, (it sounds like they are already trying to avoid her as much as possible) is to give your Aussie mix her own area when it's time to sit on the couch.

 This doesn't need to be away from the whole family area. A tall exercise pen with a mat inside can help prevent her from rehearsing the problem behavior. This should help her learn to relax in other other places than the valued resting area and away from people she may guard. It also will keep your other pets safe since she seems to struggle with other pets nearby her bed. 

This is therefore a management option, similar to closing the door when in the bathroom. Treatment though can be more involved, requiring, on top of management, behavior modification, removal of any stressors from your dog’s environment and fluent responses to redirection,  *before* your dog gets ramped up.

Behavior modification is often individualized by having a dog behavior professional come into the home, do an interview and carefully observe the dog's interactions with you and the other pets and the accompanying body language. Triggering events will need to be recorded so the professional can assess the situation carefully and provide a customized plan based on the observation and several individualized factors. 

For example, if other pets' movements when she is by her sleeping area are identified as being the exact trigger, relaxation and self control may be shaped using using positive reinforcement. She may therefore be rewarded for calmly watching your other pets without reacting.

Setups may be strategically implemented to create positive associations with pets approaching when she is near you on leash if it turns out she is guarding you or there is some form of competition over your attention. You would be therefore guided and instructed on how to keep her best under threshold https://www.braintraining4dogs.com/members/archive/threshold-levels/.

A relaxation protocol may also be needed if she's stressed. 

Of course, the approach chosen may vary based on whatever triggers are identified. Once again, this would need expert eyes on the interactions so to identify exactly what may be triggering her behaviors so to craft a customized plan. 

I hope this helps!

Let me know if you have any questions,

Best,

Adrienne 

Disclaimer: behavior modification comes with risks. If your puppy or dog shows signs of potential aggression (lunging, barking, growling, snapping, biting) for safety, please consult with a dog behavior professional who uses force-free behavior modification techniques (no shock, prongs, or physical corrections) for direct in-person guidance. Board-certified veterinary behaviorists and Certified Applied Animal Behaviorists are often the top experts in the field. Articles, videos and general info found in the forums or course (or any online source) are not meant to replace in-person training/instruction. By using this course and forum, you are waiving any liability claims or other type of claims related to any dogs' behavior against you or others.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...